Podcast: Don't Kill the Messenger with Movie Research Expert Kevin Goetz
Guest: Roy Lee

Interview Transcript:

Announcer (00:03):

From script to screen, every film is brought to life by visionary creatives and executives, all sharing one mission to captivate the audience. Hosted by award-winning movie strategist, Kevin Goetz. Our podcast, Don't Kill the Messenger, offers a filmmaking masterclass through intimate conversations with Hollywood's most influential voices. And now, your host, Kevin Goetz.

Kevin Goetz (00:29):

I am fascinated by the paths that successful producers take. When you graduate from college, you rarely know exactly where you'll end up, right? You may have a plan, but careers often unfold through unexpected opportunities, chance encounters, and instincts that only make sense in hindsight. My guest today is a perfect example. After graduating from law school, he wasn't immediately producing movies. He was working at a law firm, but then a move to Los Angeles led him to an unlikely job as a script tracker, ultimately starting his own platform, giving him a front-row seat to the information and deal-making that drives Hollywood. And his ingenuity didn't stop there. Roy built a reputation for finding opportunities where others saw risk, creating one of the most unconventional producing careers in town, whether adapting international films, championing horror, or identifying emerging trends. He's often ahead of the curve.

(01:37):

Along the way, he helped bring films to audiences around the world, including The Ring, The Grudge, the Oscar-winning The Departed, It, Dr. Sleep, The Lego Movie, How to Train Your Dragon, and a Minecraft Movie. Roy, I can't tell you how excited I am to have you here. Thank you so much for joining me.

Roy Lee (01:58):

You’re welcome. Thanks for having me.

Kevin Goetz (02:00):

So, Roy, we are cut from very similar cloth in terms of our entrepreneurial spirit. Have you always had that?

Roy Lee (02:06):

I think so. I've always just did things whatever I felt like and felt right and just went with the flow all the time.

Kevin Goetz (02:12):

Your dad was a doctor.

Roy Lee (02:14):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (02:15):

Your mother was a stay-at-home mom?

Roy Lee (02:17):

School teacher.

Kevin Goetz (02:18):

She was a school teacher?

Roy Lee (02:19):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (02:20):

She wanted you to be a minister, I understand. 

Roy Lee (02:23):

She’s very religious. 

Kevin Goetz (02:24):

What religion?

Roy Lee (02:25):

She was a Baptist.

Kevin Goetz (02:26):

Wow.

Roy Lee (02:27):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (02:28):

And so, did you go to any kind of seminary school or - 

Roy Lee (02:32):

No, I.

Kevin Goetz (02:32):

Theological school or -

Roy Lee (02:34):

That was her desire. I had no interest in it whatsoever. She always tried to get me to go to church. It was just not my thing.

Kevin Goetz (02:41):

You have siblings?

Roy Lee (02:42):

I have a brother.

Kevin Goetz (02:42):

And was it his thing? 

Roy Lee (02:44):

No, he's a doctor. <laugh>

Kevin Goetz (02:45):

He's a doctor?

Roy Lee (02:46):

He's a doctor.

Kevin Goetz (02:47):

Did your dad pressure you to be a doctor? 

Roy Lee (02:49):

He did not. He didn't really have any opinion of what I should do, just as long as I was making a living.

Kevin Goetz (02:56):

How did you fall into law?

Roy Lee (02:57):

That was something where it felt like the thing to do at the time. I just knew a lot of other people that were lawyers or going to law school, and it was near a house that I was living in DC.

Kevin Goetz (03:08):

If I told the 10-year-old Roy that you would have produced The Ring, The Grudge, It, Minecraft, Lego, and the success of those, what would you have thought at that age?

Roy Lee (03:23):

I wouldn't think it'd be totally crazy. I mean, it would just be something I did.

Kevin Goetz (03:27):

Really?

Roy Lee (03:28):

Yeah.

Kevin Goetz (03:29):

It sounds like you just didn't really know exactly what you wanted to do. You kind of went with the flow.

Roy Lee (03:34):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (03:35):

So, did you see movies as a kid? Did you like movies? 

Roy Lee (03:39):

I liked movies, but I don't think I studied them. I remember seeing the movies that my mother would take us to. I remember seeing horror movies very young, just because the religious aspect of movies like The Exorcist and The Omen. I would see those with my mother.

Kevin Goetz (03:55):

Like, how old were you?

Roy Lee (03:56):

I'd say under 10.

Kevin Goetz (03:59):

Wow.

Roy Lee (03:59):

Yeah.

Kevin Goetz (04:00):

And she's religious? <laugh>

Roy Lee (04:02):

It was more like to scare me into, like, this is what it - Oh. The devil is like and -

Kevin Goetz (04:09):

Oh. Something strikes me about you, and I've said it to you before. To me, you are one of the most interesting men that I've encountered. Sort of enigmatic. Kind of mysterious. You don't seem to wanna be in the spotlight. That's what I get from you. You are very much a behind the scenes kind of person.

Roy Lee (04:32):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (04:33):

How does it feel being on the podcast right now? Are you comfortable with this format or is it because we're friends that you're saying, "Okay, I'm gonna do this for Kevin."

Roy Lee (04:43):

Yes. Uh, you asked me to, and I did it. But I generally don't do a lot of interviews.

Kevin Goetz (04:47):

I know you don't. Which I so appreciate. I am in awe of what you've done. I'm also in awe of the way you did it and the way you approached it. And that's kind of what I wanted to unpack today, because I think that's sort of the most interesting thing. Kind of your path. You must have an extraordinary intellect. You must have an IQ that's off the charts. Have you ever had it tested? I'm really serious.

Roy Lee (05:09):

No.

Kevin Goetz (05:10):

You have the left and right brain going like in equal measure, which is a very rare trait. You started this business that really changed the way script tracking was done. So you come to Hollywood and you become a script tracker.

Roy Lee (05:27):

Well, yeah, a development executive at a production company where I had to know what the scripts, the manuscripts, and all the new projects that are coming out of the agencies and management companies and publishing companies. 

Kevin Goetz (05:37):

What kind of company was it? It

Roy Lee (05:38):

Was a company called Alphaville. It was a production company. It was - 

Kevin Goetz (05:41):

Who was running it?

Roy Lee (05:41):

Sean Daniel and Jim Jacks.

Kevin Goetz (05:44):

I love those guys. Jim, of course, passed away. Can you tell me when you left there and why you left to start your own tracking business?

Roy Lee (05:54):

The tracking was done while I was at the company. It was more of a - 

Kevin Goetz (05:57):

But wasn't it your own sort of invention? Like this is so inefficient.

*Roy Lee (06:00):

It was, because like part of the job was to just know what the projects were that were coming out. And so we would, at the time, would spend the whole day calling other people in town and just getting their information and just forming your own little group of people that would share information that would have deals at other studios. So you wouldn't necessarily compete with them at your own studio. Our deal was at Universal, so I would get to know somebody at Sony and somebody at Fox and somebody at Disney so that I would know what they would be receiving or know what the other people were receiving. And then we just put up a report at the end of the day and show what is out there. Or at the end of the week, you'd have the whole week's - 

Kevin Goetz (06:39):

Yeah, but you ended up commercializing it.

Roy Lee (06:40):

Well, what changed was that people were maybe doing emails and just putting it there. I had created a database where it was a centralized -

Kevin Goetz (06:48):

Repository.

Roy Lee (06:49):

Yeah, one page document that all of us could edit, put our comments to, as opposed to spending eight hours a day, we could just go to this document, all share this one document, put up our information, and it would change it to 30 minutes a day.

Kevin Goetz (07:03):

And did you make money from that?

Roy Lee (07:04):

Yeah, about 60,000 every time I asked for, like, people to send me $100. At its peak, there were about 600 different executives on it. And I would just say, "Can you send me 100 bucks just to expense it?" 

Kevin Goetz (07:15):

And Alphaville didn't mind you doing that? 

*Roy Lee (07:17):

I just didn't tell anybody. I just - Oh my God, I love you. It was just like one of these things where it's, it, I just didn't just ask. Right.

Kevin Goetz (07:23):

And you were benefiting them.

Roy Lee (07:24):

Yeah. Every, like, this saved them a lot of time. So I had to deposit it in less than $10,000 increments, but my mailbox would be filled with $100 checks.

Kevin Goetz (07:32):

That's incredible. Did you ever think about, like, selling it at someone? 

Roy Lee (07:35):

Oh, we did sell it. Eventually. Who's we? Well, when I was at Bender Spink, I was doing the tracking board there, and I sold it to a company called iFilm, which was a part of CNET, I think at the time.

Kevin Goetz (07:47):

They were the owner of the company that I was at called OTX.

Roy Lee (07:51):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (07:52):

That was in 2003 when I joined OTX from NRG. Mm-hmm. That's so funny.

Roy Lee (08:00):

Yeah.

Kevin Goetz (08:00):

IFilm was the company that Shelley Zalis sold OTX to, and then online research was sort of born. OTX is Online Testing Exchange. Yeah. So iFilm was the perfect place to sell that. So let's go to how you began as a producer. What attracted you to talent? You kinda came into it from an interesting way.

Roy Lee (08:26):

Well, I was just looking for other areas that people weren't looking. And at the time, like, 2001, 2000, there wasn't streaming, so you couldn't see all these foreign films, like the Asian films, other than through film festivals. 

Kevin Goetz (08:40):

Did you like Asian films?

Roy Lee (08:41):

I had not seen any of them other than the Godzilla ones that were released theatrically and - 

Kevin Goetz (08:46):

Like the Japanese versions? 

Roy Lee (08:47):

Yeah, just like in, like, I wouldn't say I'd see anything but those, and maybe rarely saw any Asian films.

Kevin Goetz (08:53):

Were your parents first generation?

Roy Lee (08:55):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (08:55):

Korean?

Roy Lee (08:56):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (08:57):

Ah. Did you watch Korean films?

Roy Lee (08:59):

Never had seen one. So, yeah, I was just looking at other areas and also seeing that the development to production conversion rate was under 5%. So, like, of all the projects that were set up at the studio, if you set up a studio - 

Kevin Goetz (09:15):

You mean in Hollywood?

Roy Lee (09:15):

In Hollywood, yes. Oh, got it. So you, you would set up a project and you'd read about it, but less than 5% of those get made from the announcement to production. 

Kevin Goetz (09:25):

Now, I've never heard that figure. That's a very interesting figure. I wonder what it actually is that are not reported. 

Roy Lee (09:30):

Yes. It's much lower.

Kevin Goetz (09:31):

Of course.

*Roy Lee (09:32):

And so that's where I just realized at the time I had to do at least 20 development projects to get one made. 

Kevin Goetz (09:40):

Oh, you're speaking my language, Roy. And also, I once had a slide in a presentation called Sundance or Vegas. And I proved how Vegas was more advantageous if you wanted to play the odds.

Roy Lee (09:54):

Yes. 

Kevin Goetz (09:55):

And I really proved it, because there was X number of submissions, and this many got picked up, and this many worked for the festival, and then this many got seen, and this many got awarded, and this many got finally sold, and it was minuscule. So that's a really interesting way to look at it because now you're saying, "How am I gonna be in this conversation?" And it was about volume. 

Roy Lee (10:18):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (10:18):

20, you figured, projects.

*Roy Lee (10:20):

Yeah, so I just decided to go get the rights to 25 Asian film titles.

Kevin Goetz (10:26):

What'd you get? 

*Roy Lee (10:27):

The Ring, the grudge, the departed, eight below, lake house, the eye, the - 

Kevin Goetz (10:33):

Who were you working for at this time?

Roy Lee (10:34):

I was just working for myself. 

Kevin Goetz (10:36):

So you left Benderspinks by now.

Roy Lee (10:37):

I was working at their offices.

Kevin Goetz (10:39):

But you were working with them or for them? 

Roy Lee (10:41):

With them. 

Kevin Goetz (10:42):

At one point, you were working with them.

Roy Lee (10:43):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (10:43):

So now you have offices. You're on your own now. And how'd you pay for these? 

Roy Lee (10:49):

I didn't have to pay for them at all. I just got them the deals in order to. Just like when a producer gets a script, they don't pay for the script when they set it up for development. The studio pays the screenwriter.

Kevin Goetz (11:01):

Well, you certainly do it if you're an independent. I've optioned many things in my life.

Roy Lee (11:04):

Yeah. I was wanting to be a studio producer.

Kevin Goetz (11:07):

Aha. Hold on. You made a decision that you were not gonna do this independently, that you were gonna go set them up big.

Roy Lee (11:13):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (11:14):

And make big bet movies.

Roy Lee (11:15):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (11:16):

That's also a very interesting choice that you made.

Roy Lee (11:19):

So that's why I wouldn't pay for them. I would have a studio pay for them. And so, because of the fact that I had created that tracking board system, I had known 600 executives and producers, other people in town in order to just get access to. And people - 

Kevin Goetz (11:34):

A meeting.

Roy Lee (11:35):

Meeting, or they also knew I had knowledge of what is going on around town. 

Kevin Goetz (11:41):

That's interesting. So as a young guy coming up in the business, I would work on the guest list at screening events in my early years at NRG. And I wanted to do that job because guess what? I had to check everyone in. So I knew who was who. Aha, that's that guy. Oh, that's Barry Diller. Oh, that whoever it is. And as a result of that, I would strike up conversations. And then I would see them again. And then again, and then again. And then they would see me in the theater seating them. And then they would see me coordinating focus groups. And then they would see me moderating focus groups. So they watched my evolution, and we're talking only two, three years. And then I became sort of the moderator that people started requesting. And that's because of building relationship early on. And you built relationships early on.

(12:36):

What was your first sale? Who did you sell it to?

Roy Lee (12:39):

Dreamworks.

Kevin Goetz (12:41):

Walter Parkes specifically?

Roy Lee (12:42):

Yes. 

Kevin Goetz (12:43):

Did you get in a meeting with Walter Parkes?

Roy Lee (12:45):

No. Mark Sourian was an executive there who lived less than a mile away from me.

Kevin Goetz (12:51):

And had, you knew him from the business?

Roy Lee (12:53):

He was in my specific tracking group.

Kevin Goetz (12:56):

Got it. And so you said, "Hey, I got something. Can I come in and talk with you?" 

*Roy Lee (13:00):

I actually just went over to his house and watched the movie with him.

Kevin Goetz (13:04):

And he said what afterwards? 

Roy Lee (13:06):

He said, "Let's get the rights to remake it." 

Kevin Goetz (13:09):

Wow. What'd they pay for him? Do you remember?

Roy Lee (13:11):

$1.3 million. 

Kevin Goetz (13:13):

You are kidding me that much?

Roy Lee (13:14):

Mm-hmm.

Kevin Goetz (13:16):

And how many subsequent movies did it spawn?

Roy Lee (13:19):

Three so far. We're working on another one.

Kevin Goetz (13:22):

And that meant you were kissed in for?

Roy Lee (13:25):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (13:26):

That is just great, Roy. And then you do the same with The Grudge.

Roy Lee (13:30):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (13:31):

The Departed. Lake House, you moved Keanu Reeves and Sandra Bullock?

Roy Lee (13:34):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (13:34):

God, I worked on every one of these movies. You and I have seen each other a lot, lot, lot over the years. But ironically, as I said earlier, we didn't have that much interaction because you never had bravado. You never needed to be at the center. You always intrigued me. And it wasn't until recently, and I finally shared that with you. And maybe you were surprised. I mean, we've had a lunch before, but we never really palled around. And I hope that changes. So, although you have kids and I don't think you pal around that much.

Roy Lee (14:06):

I don't go out that much. 

Kevin Goetz (14:07):

I know. How old are your kids? 

Roy Lee (14:09):

I have a 20, a 22, and a seven.

Kevin Goetz (14:12):

Wow, that's a big age difference. 

Roy Lee (14:14):

Second marriage.

Kevin Goetz (14:15):

Are you close with all the kids?

Roy Lee (14:16):

Yeah. 

Kevin Goetz (14:17):

Your kids wanna be in the business, the older ones?

Roy Lee (14:19):

The oldest is actually working on the first movie set starting this weekend. She's the assistant for the director of movie. It's called Four by Four.

Kevin Goetz (14:29):

And that's one of yours?

Roy Lee (14:30):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (14:30):

You typically executive produce, not produce?

Roy Lee (14:33):

I don’t really care. I just, like, whatever.

Kevin Goetz (14:34):

It’s not about caring. I mean, how involved are you?

Roy Lee (14:37):

In various involvement. Because this year, we have about 18 different productions, so I can't really be involved with everything. 

Kevin Goetz (14:43):

What’s the name of your company?

Roy Lee (14:44):

Vertigo.

Kevin Goetz (14:45):

Vertigo has 18 - 

Roy Lee (14:47):

Some are sequels. Pictures. Some are TV shows. 

Kevin Goetz (14:50):

Who cares? I mean, who has 18 projects? How many people work for Vertigo? 

Roy Lee (14:55):

Six people. But that's why we have partners on things, and we're just involved with all these - 

Kevin Goetz (14:58):

Just look at him. Listen to it again. The sweetest man. Do you ever get angry? 

Roy Lee (15:03):

I try to go a whole year without losing my temper with somebody, but, like, every now and then I do get angry.

Kevin Goetz (15:08):

You don't have to give me a name, but you're so even-tempered. I wanna know when you lost it. Over what situation?

Roy Lee (15:14):

Well, somebody called and accused me of doing something. Like, wrong.

Kevin Goetz (15:18):

Wrong.

Roy Lee (15:19):

And

Kevin Goetz (15:19):

You don't play that game?

Roy Lee (15:21):

Yeah.

Kevin Goetz (15:21):

Who runs your company? Other than yourself, obviously.

Roy Lee (15:26):

Well, everyone can do whatever they want in terms of the amount of how much they wanna participate on projects.

Kevin Goetz (15:33):

Is he a dream or what? Okay, God. I have so many questions. I'd like to know what it is about your spidey sense or your gut brain that tells you that something's gonna work. Give me either the visceral, the intellectual, is it both? Process that you go through after reading a script.

*Roy Lee (15:54):

Well, I always want to love a script. 

Kevin Goetz (15:57):

I mean, let's stop right there. That alone is very revealing, that you always wanna love a script. I just came back from a lunch meeting before this podcast, and one of the things we talked about was how most people wanna say no. They don't wanna say yes. Yes is very scary. No is the easy thing. It's to say, "Well, we have something like it. Well, we this, well that." But to get people to a yes is a different kind of commitment, isn't it? And you say yes out of the gate.

Roy Lee (16:25):

I want to. I

Kevin Goetz (16:27):

I understand. 

Roy Lee (16:28):

But it's not often the case. 

Kevin Goetz (16:30):

That's a different story.

*Roy Lee (16:31):

I would say, like, when I start reading a script, so I read between 4:00 and 6:00 AM every day. I read the first act of pretty much all the scripts, unless it's, I know immediately that's not something I would like. If I don't really care what's going to happen with the rest of the characters or the situation, then even if it's written incredibly well, it's not for me. I just would stop reading. 

Kevin Goetz (16:52):

I know people that will read the first act, and then they'll read kind of the last 10 pages. If they're not interested to see if my God did or miss something. You don't even go there. 

Roy Lee (17:02):

I don't even. If I don't care after the first act, I'd just stop.

Kevin Goetz (17:05):

Wow.

*Roy Lee (17:05):

Yeah. And if I do like it, but I could predict the whole movie or know sort of how the rest of the movie goes, I don't wanna do it either. It's when it takes me in a direction that I didn't expect, but fits within the logic of the story. That's when I would, like, get really excited about it. 

Kevin Goetz (17:23):

You seem to have a proclivity towards horror. 

Roy Lee (17:26):

I just like horror in general. But, uh, there's other things. 

Kevin Goetz (17:29):

You can thank Mom for that from The Exorcist and the Omen.

Roy Lee (17:32):

Possibly.

Kevin Goetz (17:34):

It had to make a impression on you as a young boy somehow somewhere.

Roy Lee (17:37):

And Stephen King. I read Stephen King when I was really good. 

Kevin Goetz (17:40):

Were you a reader, yeah?

Roy Lee (17:40):

Yeah.

Kevin Goetz (17:41):

What's Stephen King's, like, Pet Semetery?

Roy Lee (17:43):

Pet Semetery was actually the first book I read. I love that one.

Kevin Goetz (17:45):

Yeah. What other. Misery?

Roy Lee (17:47):

Misery, I didn't find that scary. The Shining and It were. And things like that. 

Kevin Goetz (17:52):

Oh, It. How did you do it?

Roy Lee (17:53):

That was more. At the time, Dan Lin was an executive at Warner Brothers, and since I was close with him -

Kevin Goetz (18:01):

Call out to you, Dan. He's a great guy.

Roy Lee (18:04):

Yes. And so he was the exec, and then we produced the Lego movie together, Godzilla together, It Together. When he left the studio, he partnered with me on lots of projects.

Kevin Goetz (18:13):

How inventive was his whole jam over there in that campus he built?

Roy Lee (18:17):

Right back. 

Kevin Goetz (18:18):

I mean, that was cool. Did you spend a lot of time there? I imagine you did.

Roy Lee (18:22):

I go speak at some of their events, yes. I think they were called, like, salons. 

Kevin Goetz (18:27):

I didn't even know they did those. So, it. You partnered with Dan Lin. Who had the rights to that book?

Roy Lee (18:33):

At the time, people didn't realize that Warner Brothers did own the rights, because it was made by a television company for ABC, so people just assumed it was ABC. And it was actually done by Lorimar, which was then acquired by Warner Brothers at the time. It was just sitting in the library. When I first brought it up with Dan, I was like, "You guys own the rights." You mean

Kevin Goetz (18:53):

You knew that going into Dan? 

Roy Lee (18:54):

Yes. Well, I had done the research - 

Kevin Goetz (18:57):

Right. On how to get the rights. And Warner's just didn't do anything with it. 

Roy Lee (19:00):

They hadn't done anything with it. But at the time, they didn't have a database of things to know what IP they owned. For some reason, they just wanted it to be a little bit harder for people to figure out. It just made people have to work for it, which, like, if you're lazy, then you'll never figure it out. But it's the people who do the work to find it. 

Kevin Goetz (19:19):

What'd you like about the movie itself? 

*Roy Lee (19:21):

The differences that in the book and in the miniseries, it was jumping back and forth in time. And so I proposed just doing the kids' story. And so it was just taking it and breaking it apart and just doing the kids' story as a standalone. I feel like if I really like something, then other people will like it as well. There's no revelation there.

Kevin Goetz (19:42):

Have you found yourself in terms of what your passion is?

Roy Lee (19:46):

I enjoy what I'm doing, so I guess so. I originally came to Hollywood to work in the music industry. 

Kevin Goetz (19:52):

You did?

Roy Lee (19:52):

Well, I wanted to. I wanted to be an A&R person that finds new bands.

Kevin Goetz (19:57):

So music is another love of yours? I didn't even know that.

Roy Lee (20:00):

It was, but when I got into film, then I just focused on knowing everything about it. 

Kevin Goetz (20:07):

Well, I believe, and I'm gonna go on a limb here. If you're not the best, you are one of the best in terms of your instincts. When we come back, we're going to continue talking to Roy about his extraordinarily successful career. His incredible stomach, brain, those instincts I'm talking about. We'll be back in a moment. Listeners, the Motion Picture and Television Fund is a nonprofit charitable organization that supports working and retired members of the entertainment community. This wonderfully run organization offers assistance for living and aging with dignity and purpose in the areas of health and social services, including temporary financial assistance, case management, and residential living. And has been a crucial lifeline to thousands during and beyond critical times that our industry continues to experience. To learn more, visit mptf.com. Please join me in helping others in our industry during times of need. There are so many ways to offer support and get involved.

(21:17):

Thank you. We are back with Roy Lee, someone who I have a great reverence for. Mainly because you're a renegade. You don't do things conventionally, and you're so bloody chill, but in a way that I find enviable. You don't like the press. I know you've had a pretty extensive New Yorker article written about you, and I think you were not crazy about it for a few reasons, right? 

Roy Lee (21:46):

It wasn't the most flattering article. 

Kevin Goetz (21:48):

But how could someone not say flattering things about you? How would they learn anything not flattering about you? You're not exactly a gregarious spirit who's gonna spill the beans about this or that, or you certainly feel kind and elegant to me.

Roy Lee (22:03):

Well, I could have a dark side. 

Kevin Goetz (22:05):

I don't see that at all. Well,

Roy Lee (22:07):

If I don't like somebody, I will do things to them that -

Kevin Goetz (22:10):

Like passive aggressively? 

Roy Lee (22:12):

No, no. Overtly. But I wouldn't even care if they knew it was me.

Kevin Goetz (22:15):

Okay. Well, note to self, stay on Roy's good side. <laugh> Let me turn to something that you know, inside and out movies. And in particular, this new generation coming up. You said two of your kids are ages 20 and 22 who are just sort of making their way into the world. What do you make of their generation and kind of the way they connect with films? 

*Roy Lee (22:41):

They're telling great stories and creating content for their own generation.

Kevin Goetz (22:46):

F-U-B-U. For us by us. Yes. And that has great relevance because you saw and got involved in a movie called Barbarian.

*Roy Lee (22:57):

Yes. That one was one of those scripts I knew immediately. 

Kevin Goetz (23:00):

How did you know that?

*Roy Lee (23:01):

As I was reading it, I was like, "Oh, I sort of know where this is gonna go." 'Cause like when you see the movie, you'd think that the movie is gonna be all about the torture of this woman by the guy. 

Kevin Goetz (23:10):

That's fair. That's fair.

*Roy Lee (23:11):

And so I was like the first act. I know what's gonna happen. But the characters were written so well. And the dialogue, I knew that there was something layered. 

Kevin Goetz (23:19):

Where did you get the script?

Roy Lee (23:20):

This was given to me by another producer at Boulderlight.

Kevin Goetz (23:23):

And said, "Hey, Roy, I think there's something here." 

Roy Lee (23:28):

Yes, because I had met them and they were making a lot of movies that were sub $100,000 and they wanted to break into the studio system to do studio movies, but they were having a difficult time accessing it because they were coming in from a different angle. And not having the relationships on the studio level, they were just doing their own tiny indie movies. And so I told them, "Send me your favorite script and I'll see you." 

Kevin Goetz (23:53):

What was your next move after you said, "I wanna do it?" You didn't pay for it again, you went to a studio. 

Roy Lee (23:58):

All the studios passed.

Kevin Goetz (23:59):

Wow. All of them? 

Roy Lee (24:01):

All of them. Then we had to do an independent movie. 

Kevin Goetz (24:06):

But you don't do independent movies.

Roy Lee (24:07):

Well, at the time, this was COVID time, I believe. And this will go into a whole different area, but like during COVID, pivoted the company to do smaller crews, limited cast, limited crew. And so I'd be doing movies like Watcher, Strange Darling. 

Kevin Goetz (24:22):

Did you pay for Barbarian? 

Roy Lee (24:23):

No. I would find people who -

Kevin Goetz (24:24):

Oh, you went to New Regency? Yeah. So even then, independently, you went to still get money for it. You weren't gonna put your own money in. Correct. Have you ever put your own money in a script?

Roy Lee (24:33):

No.

Kevin Goetz (24:34):

In development? Never?

Roy Lee (24:36):

No.

Kevin Goetz (24:36):

Insane.

*Roy Lee (24:37):

In fact, it was New Regency, when we gave them the script and the budget, they were like, "This is too low. You gave us an additional million dollars to, uh, make it." <laugh> Did

Kevin Goetz (24:47):

Did you spend it? 

Roy Lee (24:48):

We ended up spending it, yes. But I mean, it was four and a half million, but we, our budget was originally three and a half million.

Kevin Goetz (24:53):

Well, your buddy, Jason Blum, has done that quite successfully over the years. 

Roy Lee (24:58):

But around that time, his was a different model where he would be doing almost like director jails or who had done at least one successful movie in the past so that you have some - 

Kevin Goetz (25:08):

But he gave them full control. 

Roy Lee (25:10):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (25:10):

It wasn't only until the test screening process, not even the first screening, because he allowed them to then work on the movie. But there was a certain point at which then he said, "We'll get involved." And then Cooper and Jason and any of the other folks that were at Blumhouse would also be involved in the fixes, the changes, the editions, the whatever they were. Do you do something similar to that? You're more involved? 

*Roy Lee (25:36):

No, I'm less involved. The scripts that I had picked were excellent. And so the, most of them were like first-time filmmakers. And if I could see it on the page, I just sort of know that they could do a great job.

Kevin Goetz (25:49):

But this is your confidence. So everyone passes on Barbarian, but you still know this is a great script. What keeps the energy up so you don't give up on it? 

Roy Lee (25:59):

I was 100% sure. Like, it, it was like one of these things, like, I knew it. 

Kevin Goetz (26:02):

And isn't it great to be vindicated? 

Roy Lee (26:05):

I guess so, yeah. 

Kevin Goetz (26:05):

Oh, come on. Revenge is a dish best served cold, and the best revenge is a successful movie. Did anyone call you afterwards and say, "We were bozos?"

Roy Lee (26:15):

A few people, yes.

Kevin Goetz (26:16):

So Zach Cregger came along with the package? 

Roy Lee (26:21):

I remember reading it and I - 

Kevin Goetz (26:23):

He wrote it. 

Roy Lee (26:24):

He wrote it. 

Kevin Goetz (26:24):

But I'm saying you, you wanted him involved. And you want -

Roy Lee (26:26):

100%, like -

Kevin Goetz (26:27):

And you wanted him to direct it?

Roy Lee (26:28):

100%.

Kevin Goetz (26:30):

Had he directed anything before? 

Roy Lee (26:31):

I did not know he had directed anything before. He had co-directed with some other people, but it didn't matter to me. 

Kevin Goetz (26:36):

At four and a half million, you're saying it doesn't matter. Yep. He knows this script. He knows this. 

Roy Lee (26:41):

It could have been 100 million or two million. I would have felt the same way because the script was so great.

Kevin Goetz (26:46):

Is that why you did his next movie? 

Roy Lee (26:48):

I was lucky to be involved with his next movie, but yes. 

Kevin Goetz (26:51):

His next movie, of course, was?

Roy Lee (26:52):

Weapons.

Kevin Goetz (26:53):

And Weapons got an Academy Award. When Weapons came out and it got incredible attention, but it was so odd. It was not done before. Is that why you thought it was. 'Cause it felt like, "Oh, I, I think I know where this is going." And then it takes this turn.

Roy Lee (27:11):

It does. That's why I loved it. 

Kevin Goetz (27:13):

But did you know it was gonna be as commercial, I suppose? 

Roy Lee (27:17):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (27:17):

Did people take it right away and this time around after Barbarian?

*Roy Lee (27:21):

I remember distinctly after reading it, I had told Zach that he was gonna get 10 million dollars for it. And his agent said, "Stop saying that to him because it's raising expectations beyond what is realistic."

Kevin Goetz (27:35):

And he got $10 million.

Roy Lee (27:36):

He did.

Kevin Goetz (27:37):

You're developing Gladys now? 

Roy Lee (27:40):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (27:40):

Is Gladys a prequel?

Roy Lee (27:41):

Technically, I guess it could be. It's events before weapons, but it's not necessarily a prequel.

Kevin Goetz (27:48):

You're now working with Zach on a movie that we're both working on, Resident Evil. You are reinventing, re-imagining the franchise. 

Roy Lee (27:56):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (27:56):

In a completely fresh and new way.

*Roy Lee (27:58):

Resident Evil is going to surprise a lot of people, and I think people are gonna love it.

Kevin Goetz (28:03):

I worked on the movie and I can't talk about the movie.

Roy Lee (28:05):

Yes. 

Kevin Goetz (28:05):

But tell me why you think they're going to love it.

Roy Lee (28:08):

It depicts Resident Evil in a way that people won't know what to expect. And it's one of these things where it's so much fun to just go for the ride.

Kevin Goetz (28:17):

I'm gonna stop for a second to say that this is not an accident, folks. I'm a big believer in you couldn't be the identifier of this material. You couldn't be in touch with this newer generation if you didn't have this authenticity. And I was on Matt Bellany the other day and we had this whole conversation about Gen Z. And I talked about what I've learned through data that authenticity is the single most important thing. But you, my friend, possess it.

*Roy Lee (28:46):

Well, I look at it this way. Some people have taste and some people don't. And I believe I do have good taste.

Kevin Goetz (28:50):

You have both good taste and commercial taste, because I know a lot of people who do have good taste, but no one's gonna see it. And you somehow have the left and right brain that you can identify not only is it a good script, but people are gonna love it. Now for you, that may feel one and the same, but it's not for everybody, I can assure you. You know what I mean? 

Roy Lee (29:11):

I guess so. When I saw Infernal Affairs.

Kevin Goetz (29:13):

Infernal Affairs. Not Internal Affairs.

Roy Lee (29:15):

Correct.Infernal Affairs. 

Kevin Goetz (29:16):

Correct. And that was a Hong Kong movie?

Roy Lee (29:17):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (29:17):

And it ended up being?

Roy Lee (29:21):

The Departed.

Kevin Goetz (29:22):

The Departed. Which won the Oscar? 

*Roy Lee (29:25):

Yes. When I saw that movie for the first time, I knew immediately it was a home run. There's no doubt in my mind this would be an amazing movie. And there was no question in my mind. It was just like we had to do it. And so then I just aimed high from putting it together. And so when it was originally set up, I went to Brad Pitt first, and he saw it, and that's why he's a producer in the movie.

Kevin Goetz (29:46):

Boy, you called it. So zooming out, let's go back to your first projects. When you did your first 25 -

Roy Lee (29:56):

Yes the, the 25 Asian film for 25 months straight.

Kevin Goetz (30:00):

Wait a minute. You made all of them?

Roy Lee (30:01):

Oh, no, no. We only made 18 of them, but it was - 

Kevin Goetz (30:04):

Hold on. You had 25 rights to Asian movies that you set up 18 of them? 

Roy Lee (30:10):

No, I set up all 25, made 18 of them.

Kevin Goetz (30:13):

I've never heard that. Is it just because after the seventh or eighth, they would just come to you and they did whatever you sort of wanted them to do.

*Roy Lee (30:21):

No, I had already amassed the collection and I just spaced it out because I didn't wanna have too many at the same time, so I would just do one a month.

Kevin Goetz (30:29):

I'm curious, give me one that never got made.

Roy Lee (30:32):

My favorite one that didn't get made was called The Chaser.

Kevin Goetz (30:36):

Why?

Roy Lee (30:37):

It was a hard movie to get made because the lead character was a pimp for a studio movie. And you can't make a big studio production with a pimp as a - 

Kevin Goetz (30:49):

Can someone make it now?

Roy Lee (30:51):

Yes. I would revive it, but I'm pretty much moving past, because after the 25, I was moving on to different. Like right now I'm in 25 video games, so I'm just doing different things.

Kevin Goetz (31:02):

Tell me about Minecraft. How did a Minecraft movie get made?

*Roy Lee (31:05):

That one just went through starts and stops over the years, but it was one of these things where my daughters were obsessed with the game. It was an early access, so it was on steam, and so it was before it blew up. And at the time I was working on the Lego movie and Notch, who had created the game, I reached out to him. He wanted to discuss it.

Kevin Goetz (31:27):

But others had discussed it before.

Roy Lee (31:29):

No.

Kevin Goetz (31:29):

No one ever approached him about a movie? 

Roy Lee (31:30):

The only other person was Jill Messick, who I then partnered with, and she has now passed away.

Kevin Goetz (31:36):

What about Legendary? How'd you get them on?

Roy Lee (31:38):

They came on after the fact.

Kevin Goetz (31:40):

And then what happened?

Roy Lee (31:41):

Five Nights was put in turnaround. Nintendo went to Universal. 

Kevin Goetz (31:44):

Five Nights of Freddy's was also there?

Roy Lee (31:45):

Yep.

Kevin Goetz (31:46):

But you didn't do Five Nights.

Roy Lee (31:47):

I know. I had it at Warner Brothers.

Kevin Goetz (31:50):

How did it get out in Turnaround?

Roy Lee (31:51):

They just dumped it.

Kevin Goetz (31:52):

And who picked it up? Jason?

Roy Lee (31:54):

Jason did.

Kevin Goetz (31:55):

You loved it, didn't you?

Roy Lee (31:57):

I don't know if I loved the script, but I just knew that it was something my daughters were obsessed with as well. 

Kevin Goetz (32:03):

I know. How do you find video games? What's your process?

Roy Lee (32:08):

I go with what is popular.

Kevin Goetz (32:11):

But once it's popular, aren't you paying out the wazoo?

*Roy Lee (32:15):

I don't mind having the studios pay a lot of money for them. So, like, right now, we're in the process of doing the bestselling game of 2025, and it's getting super expensive. But the more money a studio spends, the more likely they're gonna wanna make the movie.

Kevin Goetz (32:28):

But that's a great one. We used to say in the old days, "Get him pregnant." <laugh>

Roy Lee (32:33):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (32:34):

And then you get to a point where you've got to bring that baby to term because you've got a lot invested in it.

Roy Lee (32:41):

Yes. So I don't mind it when it costs a lot of money.

Kevin Goetz (32:44):

That's very interesting to me. What are you really excited about right now that you've got? What are the next hits gonna be coming from Roy Lee?

*Roy Lee (32:53):

I would say Zach Cregger's next original film is starting production early next year. And that one, I'm not gonna talk about just because it's one of these things like weapons when people see it, and it is my favorite script he's written.

Kevin Goetz (33:05):

Holy cow. Again, a man not prone to hyperbole. Is there anything in production right now?

Roy Lee (33:13):

Possession is another one that's in prep. It starts production in two weeks.

Kevin Goetz (33:17):

Now, will you go to the set?

Roy Lee (33:18):

I will.

Kevin Goetz (33:19):

How much will you go to the set?

Roy Lee (33:21):

Maybe a week.

Kevin Goetz (33:22):

Is that regular for you? About a week on set?

Roy Lee (33:25):

Yeah, I've been on s - yes.

Kevin Goetz (33:26):

Yeah, I try to tell folks, and we've had a lot of producers, as you know, on, on my show, and it's like, if you're gonna create a big slate of movies, it's very hard to be out for months and months producing a movie. That's why I asked you the question earlier, do you executive produce? You said it doesn't matter, but what I meant to ask was, is it important for you to be on the set every day, to be in every casting session, to be in the edit bit, and it's not to you?

Roy Lee (33:53):

No. If you have - 

Kevin Goetz (33:54):

In fact, you couldn't do the volume you're doing if you were that guy.

Roy Lee (33:59):

I work with people who are much smarter than me within my company and partners on projects.

Kevin Goetz (34:04):

Who's a director you'd like to work with that you haven't?

Roy Lee (34:07):

David Fincher.

Kevin Goetz (34:09):

Have you met with him? I have. David, if you're listening, <laugh> let's get that going. I'd love to see what you do with Fincher. I think he's one of the most talented filmmakers of his generation, clearly.

Roy Lee (34:22):

I think I'll have something that he'll wanna do in the next five years.

Kevin Goetz (34:25):

Wow. You mean something that you're working to get or something that you just think the stars will line up finally?

Roy Lee (34:31):

Something I'm working to get.

Kevin Goetz (34:32):

Yeah. What excites you other than movies and so forth? What's your kind of light motif? What gets you going? Like when you have downtime or when you are not thinking about films?

Roy Lee (34:47):

Well, in the past few years, I started building custom Lego builds.

Kevin Goetz (34:53):

What's one that you've done that's like crazy?

Roy Lee (34:55):

I've built a bunch of Calvin and Hobbs Lego. How

Kevin Goetz (34:57):

Big are they?

Roy Lee (34:58):

Like 300 to 500 pieces.

Kevin Goetz (35:00):

That doesn't sound that intense. 300.

Roy Lee (35:01):

300. Well, I've built a 10,000 piece.

Kevin Goetz (35:03):

That's what I'm getting at.

Roy Lee (35:03):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (35:04):

And do you buy those?

Roy Lee (35:06):

You buy the instructions on Rebrickable. And then you upload those parts to the brick link and then they send you these huge bags of parts.

Kevin Goetz (35:16):

How long does a 10,000 tile Lego sculpture take?

Roy Lee (35:21):

Um, three days.

Kevin Goetz (35:25):

That's it? For 10,000 pieces?

Roy Lee (35:28):

I mean, I just built it last weekend, so. 

Kevin Goetz (35:30):

Do you destroy them then? Or do you save all of them?

Roy Lee (35:33):

I'm going to be putting them in my new office building.

Kevin Goetz (35:35):

Oh, I was gonna say, because your wife's like probably get them outta here.

Roy Lee (35:38):

Oh yeah. If you saw my office, it's a lot of the things that my wife had already told me to get them out of the house. <laugh>

Kevin Goetz (35:44):

What's Roy Lee's superpower?

*Roy Lee (35:46):

I never really thought of that. Having good common sense of being able to make good decisions and being able to capitalize on situations whenever they arise.

Kevin Goetz (36:00):

What did you learn from a mistake that you made? 'Cause I think it's really important to unpack for particularly younger filmmakers or people getting into the business where they can say, "If someone had told me this going in, I would've saved a lot of time. If someone had given me your tracker, as opposed to having it done manually and making eight hours turn into 30 minutes."

*Roy Lee (36:24):

I wouldn't change anything I've done in the past to get to where I am now.

Kevin Goetz (36:28):

I don't say something that different from that. I really don't. 'Cause it's all the perfect path, isn't it?

Roy Lee (36:34):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (36:35):

It all gets you from one to the other, and even the mistakes. I often say, and I don't know how you feel about this with your own kids and so when I tell it to the boys that I have helped co-parent. I say, "It's okay to make mistakes, but it's not Groundhog Day. You don't get to make the same mistake again. You learn from it and press on. But own it. Own it, live it, understand it, and then don't do it again." You feel similar to that philosophy?

Roy Lee (37:09):

Yeah, but I can't feel like I've made that many mistakes. Like things that, maybe little things, but like not - 

Kevin Goetz (37:16):

What are you most proud of?

Roy Lee (37:18):

I guess having the library of films like Barbarian to it, to Lego, just having movies that I'm very proud of.

Kevin Goetz (37:27):

What are you most proud of in your personal life?

Roy Lee (37:30):

My family and everything that we're just living a very comfortable and happy life.

Kevin Goetz (37:36):

You a good dad?

Roy Lee (37:37):

I am.

Kevin Goetz (37:38):

What would you tell that young filmmaker starting at graduating from NYU or USC or anywhere coming into the world right now? They're getting out. They wanna be in the film business. And they wanna find that differentiation that Roy Lee found. What should they do?

*Roy Lee (38:01):

Well, everyone would say just make your passion. But I don't think I would say that to everyone just because some people shouldn't be making movies. And it's only the ones that are super talented and can tell a story should be making them.

Kevin Goetz (38:14):

But everyone thinks they are talented and everyone thinks they can make them. So what would you tell someone coming out into the world? I think I'm thinking of it like what would I say? I think I'd probably say have a network of people who are like-minded. Get in a group of people that you can be creative with, bounce ideas off. Try to make something.

*Roy Lee (38:38):

I would say make a short. I think that's what the next generation of filmmakers are gonna be using AI or some sort of tool to show a narrative way of telling a story that is gonna get them attention.

Kevin Goetz (38:50):

You watch shorts?

Roy Lee (38:51):

I watch lots of shorts.

Kevin Goetz (38:52):

You do? Have you ever asked for a meeting with a filmmaker because of a short?

Roy Lee (38:57):

Yes.

Kevin Goetz (38:58):

Wow.

*Roy Lee (38:58):

In fact, the movie, his house, was from watching a short called Tickle Monster on YouTube and contact him on YouTube. And after the movie was made with New Regency, he won a BAFTA for best new filmmaker, and it's 100% of Rotten Tomatoes. Wow.

Kevin Goetz (39:15):

Now, I'm not accusing you of anything, but I'm asking the question. Why did you not get Obsession and why did you not get Backrooms?

*Roy Lee (39:23):

I met with Kane when he was 16. I just didn't think that anyone would finance a movie for a young person like that.

Kevin Goetz (39:30):

You saw the talent?

Roy Lee (39:31):

I did.

Kevin Goetz (39:32):

Damn, boy. You did.

Roy Lee (39:34):

I'm, uh, he met with a lot of producers.

Kevin Goetz (39:36):

I know, but I'm saying, so you did. But you didn't. Did he have that script?

Roy Lee (39:40):

He did not.

Kevin Goetz (39:41):

Were you envious that they made it, that it got away from you because those were so successful?

*Roy Lee (39:46):

Of course I'm envious, but I'm very happy that it happened. And again, I'm glad - I am too. Every producer, whenever somebody else has a huge hit, they're envious. There's no question about it. But it's, it's just like you just wanna work harder to find your thing.

Kevin Goetz (39:58):

How competitive are you?

Roy Lee (40:00):

I'm fairly competitive, but I feel like if I really want something, I'll always get it.

Kevin Goetz (40:06):

God, you're really something. AI, before we break, I can't not talk about it. I have some very strong feelings about artificial intelligence. I say that it's inevitable and it's here. And we've just scratched the surface. What does our business look like in five years in terms of AI?

Roy Lee (40:30):

Yeah. It'll bring costs down tremendously.

Kevin Goetz (40:32):

How?

Roy Lee (40:32):

The visual effects will be nowhere near what it is from last year or the year before.

Kevin Goetz (40:38):

Have you ever run an analysis on what do you think it would actually save percentage-wise on a budget?

Roy Lee (40:44):

It depends on what type of movie you're making.

Kevin Goetz (40:45):

Well, let's say we're making the ring today.

Roy Lee (40:48):

It would've saved 20 million.

Kevin Goetz (40:54):

Really? I don't know what the budget was.

Roy Lee (40:56):

60. 

Kevin Goetz (40:57):

So it would've saved, wow, a third - 

Roy Lee (40:58):

No, because I'm just saying that - 

Kevin Goetz (40:59):

A third of the budget.

*Roy Lee (41:00):

It would save a lot of money on the VFX. And it's not necessarily like if you input what you need done and it makes it so that it's more streamlined and done quicker with less labor, then it's gonna save.

Kevin Goetz (41:13):

Other than visual effects, where else?

Roy Lee (41:15):

I've gotten projects where it's like the animatics are all done. The storyboards could be done that way.

Kevin Goetz (41:21):

What about readers?

Roy Lee (41:23):

Readers, that's where I think it's gonna make Hollywood suffer, where th- the current junior executives are less likely to be reading scripts as much.

Kevin Goetz (41:36):

I agree with you.

Roy Lee (41:36):

And they won't be able to see what a great screenwriter can do.

Kevin Goetz (41:44):

What about actors?

Roy Lee (41:46):

I don't think you're gonna be seeing a lot of AI generated actors. You might be seeing actors be in situations where they look younger and appearance-wise, or maybe a body double's been used.

Kevin Goetz (41:58):

But they do that now with CGI.

Roy Lee (41:59):

They do. It's just gonna be a lot cheaper.

Kevin Goetz (42:02):

But the thing I wanna say is I have sort of a disagreement with that, and I wanna preface it by saying that I think we're gonna see more of a bifurcation of what I'll call the cinematic arts versus the commercial arts. And the commercial arts are many programmers, things that are more fungible. And whether it's soap operas or whether it's. And I mean, no disrespect to soap opera actors. I just know that the way in which you churn that kind of thing or a movie that might be an, you know, many of the movies that I made for Lifetime, for example, can be done with artificial int -

Roy Lee (42:44):

Oh, verticals as well. Those are the - Verticals, come on. That's gonna be the first wave of AI generating. Right, of course.

Kevin Goetz (42:49):

It already is. Yeah. Starting already. So I'm saying, do you, you agree with that assessment of this idea of commercial arts versus film arts?

Roy Lee (42:56):

That's true. I was just talking about the cinematic movies.

Kevin Goetz (43:00):

But if you look at the whole -

Roy Lee (43:01):

Yeah, landscape- Landscape, exactly. Of content. If you're saying just content of, and including all of the -

Kevin Goetz (43:07):

But that would include then also art direction and production design. Those things would be highly affected. It's such a hot topic right now. And particularly the young generation, like your daughters, I know from the research I've done, are particularly cringey about it. They really don't want to see AI anything at this. They're so cynical and skeptical about it. And those of us who've been through many disruptions, like the two of us, I think are more almost accepting that, hey, things change and the world doesn't end.

Roy Lee (43:38):

But we're in the infant stages of AI, so you could tell. That's what I mean.

Kevin Goetz (43:41):

Infancy.

*Roy Lee (43:42):

Yeah. And so once it gets more further advanced, it's gonna be harder to tell a difference, and the average consumer's not gonna care.

Kevin Goetz (43:49):

Exactly. That's exactly my thought. Final question here. What's the one thing we don't know about Roy Lee?

Roy Lee (43:57):

One thing you don't know about me is.

Kevin Goetz (44:00):

Just a little secret.

Roy Lee (44:02):

I don't like to tell secrets. I'm pretty transparent.

Kevin Goetz (44:06):

Well, if it's not a secret, something that no one knows about you. That doesn't have to be a secret. It just means that no one's asked you. You have a dream of something or are you living your perfect life?

*Roy Lee (44:19):

I'm living my perfect life because I'm extremely happy with everything that's going on, and I am someone who is totally content with everything that's going on now.

Kevin Goetz (44:29):

That's great. Well, you're an inspiration, so Roy, I thank you so much for doing this. I know that this is not your comfort zone and you're a real pal. And I promise as long as you'll have me, I will be happy to work on any movie that you're ever involved with. And I hope we continue our friendship for years to come.

Roy Lee (44:46):

I hope so too.

Kevin Goetz (44:47):

Thanks, Roy. To our listeners, I hope you enjoyed this conversation. For more insights into filmmaking, audience testing, and the business of Hollywood, I invite you to check out my books, Audienceology, and How to Score in Hollywood. You can also follow me on my social media. Next time on Don't Kill the Messenger, I'll be joined by Academy Award-nominated screenwriter and director, Billy Ray. Until then, I'm Kevin Goetz. And to you, our listeners, I appreciate you being part of the movie-making process. Your opinions matter.

Host: Kevin Goetz
Guest: Roy Lee
Producer: Kari Campano
Writers: Kevin Goetz, Darlene Hayman, Nick Nunez, and Kari Campano
Audio Engineer: Gary Forbes (DG Entertainment)